S5E11 Were the Kennedys Responsible for Marilyn Monroe's Death

[00:00:00] Koji: All right. We're talking about the most famous suspicious death in history. But let's bring it to 2026. If you were found dead tomorrow under mysterious circumstances, what item found at the crime scene would spark the wildest conspiracy theories about you, Cat or Dwayne? What do you guys think?

[00:00:14] Dwyane: It depends. Because they might find ginger ale and pretzels. And then I don't know if that's gonna.

[00:00:20] Koji: Like an excessive amount or just a normal amount.

[00:00:23] Dwyane: Um, what do you think is excessive? I guess is the question.

[00:00:26] Koji: That probably means it's excessive

[00:00:28] Dwyane: Right? Right, right.

[00:00:28] Koji: If you have to ask.

[00:00:30] Dwyane: And also like like my Instagram, you know, what am I watching? You know, because I try to, like, balance my algorithm. You know what I mean? So, like, I might be watching girls twerk or I might be watching like how to do, you know, indoor gardening. So it depends on what my like what screen I'm on too. I don't think there's anything else too ridiculous. I do have a lot of baby powder, more than I than a person should have. Only because I keep forgetting I have it. Then I buy more. So

[00:01:00] Koji: All right Cat.

[00:01:04] Cat: Does this have to be something that I do have in my home? Or just an item that I think would be mysterious?

[00:01:09] Koji: Either?

[00:01:10] Cat: Okay. I think it'd be really crazy if I had a lot of rope.

[00:01:14] Koji: Do you have a lot of rope?

[00:01:15] Cat: No, but if I hadn't that, that would be crazy.

[00:01:18] Dwyane: Do you do you wish you had more rope?

[00:01:20] Cat: No, but I think that would definitely spawn conspiracy. They'd be like, why does this person have so much rope? Are they going around? Are they lassoing people? Are they like hanging other people? Like, what's going on with the rope? Uh, in real life, something I have a lot of that people would think was weird. Is dog sweaters.

[00:01:37] Dwyane: Interesting?

[00:01:38] Koji: Like for dogs or sweaters with dogs on it?

[00:01:40] Cat: And no, for dogs.

[00:01:42] Dwyane: And you have a dog or you don't have a dog.

[00:01:43] Cat: I have a dog, okay? I have a dog.

[00:01:45] Koji: At least you have a dog. That'd be.

[00:01:46] Cat: But if I disappeared under mysterious circumstances and that so would my dog, I imagine we would disappear together.

[00:01:53] Koji: Yeah, mine. Mine would be dogs, too. About dog. It'd be just the amount of dog pictures in my Dropbox.

[00:01:57] Dwyane: Okay.

[00:01:58] Koji: Because I'm very I'm very meticulous about organizing my pictures. It comes a lot from like, I spent a long time looking through my mom's stuff, and there's a lot of pictures that were like, this is a side of a mountain, and there's nobody in it, you know? And I'm like, this.

[00:02:10] Dwyane: Would they, like, ascertain, you think from these pictures?

[00:02:13] Koji: I don't know, it'd just be weird. There's just so many pictures. Although I have a funny story about this, about dog pictures. So, um, one of the things I always do when I meet people is I always say, what's on. You know, whoever's on your phone is kind of an indication of what kind of person you are. Usually it's like boyfriend, girlfriend, husband, wife, children, animals, something right.

[00:02:30] Dwyane: In the picture.

[00:02:31] Koji: Yeah, the picture on the screen, on their lock screen or home screen. I remember one time I was at this on the set of with A Famous person, and we were at lunch and we went around the table was like, you know, mine was like my son or my dog or whatever. And the famous actor, it was actually him on the screen. And so it was like super uncomfortable and everyone was like, and the producer kicked me because he got angry at me about doing it. The reason I say this story is because there was a time when my best friend had this Instagram model girl wife. And so he always had like half naked pictures of her on his screen, which I thought was weird, but whatever. And then he's like. And one time I was giving him shit about it. He's like, well, what's on your screen? Like, you know. And I was like, all right, let's look at it. And it was my dog's crotch.

[00:03:11] Dwyane: Wow.

[00:03:12] Cat: Why?

[00:03:15] Koji: Because it was all furry. I thought it was cute.

[00:03:17] Dwyane: He still has the wife, right, or. No.

[00:03:18] Koji: No, no, no, they they broke up.

[00:03:20] Dwyane: Oh, man. But I know what you're talking about too.

[00:03:21] Koji: But. But it was pretty funny, though. It was just like. Like what was important to us. So I think that would be like. I mean, there's so many random pictures of the dog that, like, you might be like, well, why is he taking that? Why is he taking a picture of the dog's crotch? You know, like, why is he doing this? Why is he why is he a picture of him? You know? Like his paw. Like a really close picture of his paw. So I think people would just be like, what the fuck is wrong with this guy?

[00:03:41] Dwyane: That'd be a deep dive. I like that because then there's so many theories that can spawn off that, you know? I also have not on my person, but I do own too many zip ties.

[00:03:51] Cat: Oh, that would be serious.

[00:03:52] Dwyane: Well, because it's just, you know, you buy some and you forget where they are, and then you think you need them. And you only you always need one, you know, to tie a wire or something, but you buy a whole pack of them and then you just keep not. And then you find the ones that you had and now you have two bags.

[00:04:09] Koji: I think you're speaking for yourself then.

[00:04:10] Dwyane: You're.

[00:04:10] Cat: Very specific. But I could see myself in that scenario.

[00:04:13] Dwyane: Yeah. Then you end up with like five bags of zip ties. And I was like, why do you have. It's like, yeah, because I had to put up. I had to string up three wires and I just kept buying new entire bags

[00:04:29] Cat: Welcome to the unofficial official Story podcast. This is episode 11 of season five. Join us as we dive into the quirky, mysterious and bizarre. From unsolved mysteries to peculiar pop culture phenomena, we uncover hidden stories and explore alternate realities. My name is at Cat Elva Monroe-rado.

[00:04:55] Dwyane: Hi, guys, I'm Dwayne Fitzgerald.

[00:04:58] Koji: Oh, that's a good one.

[00:04:59] Cat: Okay.

[00:04:59] Dwyane: Yes, yes, because of, uh, it's a nod to JFK, but also to, uh, uh, to Gatsby. Yeah.

[00:05:05] Koji: Well, that was a different time period, though.

[00:05:06] Cat: Yeah, yeah, but it's still in the past.

[00:05:08] Koji: Okay. All right. I'm Koji Kennedy because I always wanted to be a Kennedy.

[00:05:15] Dwyane: Oh, is that right?

[00:05:16] Koji: I mean, actually, it would be awesome to be a Kennedy.

[00:05:19] Dwyane: I met Kennedy once. Distant, distant cousin. No benefits. Yeah. Um, got a theory or mystery you want us to explore? Send it our way. And we might feature it in an upcoming episode.

[00:05:30] Koji: Well, we passed February, but it was Presidents Day, so we are going to be honoring John F Kennedy by talking about his affairs today. We're going to find out, were the Kennedys responsible for Marilyn Monroe's death?

[00:05:41] Cat: Now, without further ado, here is the official story.

[00:05:44] Koji: Marilyn Monroe was found dead in her Los Angeles home on August 5th, 1962. She was lying on her bed naked with a telephone in one hand, surrounded by empty bottles of pills. While the death was ruled a suicide, many believe that Robert Kennedy, JFK or both of them had something to do with it.

[00:06:00] Dwyane: Monroe allegedly had sexual affairs with one or both of the Kennedys. Many calls leading up to her death referenced these affairs when calling her estate agent and friend, Arthur James. She said that Robert Kennedy had cut her off cold, and in a later call to another friend, Ann Carter, she said she was very much in love and was going to marry Bobby Kennedy. Carter described the tone as delusional and depressed. Hours before her death, Monroe called Doctor Ralph Greenson her psychiatrist, after apparently meeting with a man who she had been having sexual relations with. Greenson referred to this man as extremely important in government at the highest level. Around five hours later, she called her hairdresser and close friend Sidney. Uh Goliath. Goliath and spoke of betrayals by men in high places and clandestine love affairs. In the words of Goliath herself.

[00:06:59] Koji: You think she was talking about the mayor of South Pasadena?

[00:07:02] Dwyane: Yeah, right. She could have been. She could have been.

[00:07:05] Cat: Maybe she meant, like, physically highest levels of government. Like, isn't Denver high up? It's the mayor of Denver.

[00:07:11] Koji: She can't worry about the mayor.

[00:07:12] Dwyane: Some guy in a clock tower. He was in high places

[00:07:16] Cat: Maybe north. Maybe it's the mayor of Canada, I don't know.

[00:07:20] Koji: Greenland. Oh, sorry.

[00:07:21] Cat: Most importantly, she claimed that Robert Kennedy had been at her house earlier, threatening and yelling at her. She claimed he had promised to marry her and he had broken it off. Other sources report Robert Kennedy's presence at her house at this time. He was definitely in Los Angeles on that day, and Monroe's maid, Eunice Murray, confirmed he had been at the house and had a brief argument with her.

[00:07:48] Koji: You know, it's funny. Whenever I hear Robert Kennedy, it's gotten ruined because of the dude. The other Kennedy right now.

[00:07:52] Cat: Oh, yeah. That one.

[00:07:53] Koji: Like now.

[00:07:54] Cat: Brain worms Kennedy Junior.

[00:07:55] Koji: I can only think about him like snorting coke off the bathroom or swimming in sewage or in that voice. God, he's ruined everything. Kennedy used to be like somebody I like. I liked kind of.

[00:08:05] Cat: Mhm.

[00:08:06] Dwyane: Right, right. And and, uh, JFK Jr. Never came back.

[00:08:10] Koji: No he did, he did.

[00:08:11] Dwyane: He was.

[00:08:11] Koji: He came.

[00:08:11] Cat: Oh yeah. He was supposed to return.

[00:08:13] Koji: He came back.

[00:08:13] Cat: He came back. 

[00:08:16] Dwyane: Well he kept it on the low.

[00:08:17] Cat: Yeah. Well, Michael Jackson and Robin Williams were also supposed to come back the same day, so I don't know if you knew that. Yeah, that was the thing.

[00:08:23] Koji: They all came back. So why would the Kennedys either kill Marilyn themselves or have her killed? There are a couple of theories. Monroe's death could be a cover up for either the affairs himself or state secrets. However, there was some knowledge of Kennedy's having affairs, and FBI documents seem unconcerned with either man telling Monroe classified information. There was one concern. There's a lunch she had with JFK where nuclear weapons were discussed, this information would have been useful to Soviet intelligence.

[00:08:50] Dwyane: The FBI had also been keeping a 105 file on Monroe which investigated her political activity. That's when they think you might be doing espionage or something under J. Edgar Hoover. That mostly meant leftist. And Monroe was openly a leftist with concerns about nuclear testing. Some thought she was a communist, making her a threat to the nation. But she wasn't shown to be actively involved in any LA communist groups. Plus, it was a Cold War, so everyone thought everyone was a commie.

[00:09:20] Koji: Everyone was a commie.

[00:09:21] Cat: Everyone still thinks everyone's a commie. Nothing has changed.

[00:09:26] Koji: Although it's pretty funny that people think Nazis were socialists. They're always like, I'm like, just because they said in the name doesn't mean they're actually.

[00:09:32] Dwyane: No, it meant something different. Yeah.

[00:09:33] Cat: Yeah. Okay.

[00:09:34] Koji: Well, I mean.

[00:09:34] Cat: They're socialists and I'm black.

[00:09:35] Koji: No. So they only said they actually only said the National Socialist Party and they use red to, to trick Communists in Germany to join the National Socialist Party. It was actually intentional.

[00:09:46] Dwyane: So even back then, people didn't pay attention.

[00:09:48] Koji: Yeah. So they would like so they would have like those like they'd have like a beer hall event and they'd say National Socialist Party. And then they would have in red all over the place, and then people would be like, oh, I'm a communist. And then they'd show up and they'd be like, Nazi. And then they'd eventually just join because they're stupid. But yeah, people are pretty funny about that. All right. So is nuclear Armageddon good for state talk? What is the what is the absolute worst topic to bring up when you're trying to seduce a president? Epstein. Epstein file. Probably. 

[00:10:13] Dwyane: Epstein file or, um, I guess his wife, if he's if he's married.

[00:10:17] Cat: This is true. Great answer. At the time, the Kennedys political enemies were trying to get dirt on them. Fred Otash, a Hollywood private eye hired to keep tabs on RFK and JFK, wired several homes, including Marilyn Monroe's apartment and later, her house. The surveillance confirmed Monroe and JFK had a sexual affair, although this was one of many for JFK Otash's surveillance also captured Monroe's meeting with Robert Kennedy the night of her death. This corroborates previous accounts of the story. They argued, and Monroe demanded to know why RFK wouldn't marry her. There were sounds that could have been a sexual encounter, and then an arrangement for Kennedy to call Monroe once he left the area. Killing Monroe would have saved the Kennedys from political strife or even ruin.

[00:11:10] Koji: Kennedy was married.

[00:11:11] Dwyane: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. They both were.

[00:11:13] Koji: Yeah. That's why he couldn't have married Monroe.

[00:11:16] Cat: Because he would have had to get divorced. And then.

[00:11:18] Koji: Yes. And getting a divorce back then would have meant that he probably wouldn't have been president, because back then we cared about those kinds of things.

[00:11:24] Dwyane: Absolutely.

[00:11:24] Koji: Now he can, you know, marry whoever a stripper from Eastern Europe. I'm not gonna I'm not I'm not mentioning any names. But, you know.

[00:11:32] Dwyane: You can be royalty and marry a girl from, uh.

[00:11:35] Cat: From a TV show called show.

[00:11:36] Dwyane: Yeah. What was that show called? Suits.

[00:11:39] Cat: Suits?

[00:11:39] Dwyane: Yes. Yes. If a private eye while you're at your your house, what is the most boring thing they would hear that would make them quit the job immediately?

[00:11:47] Cat: Just the sound of the show How to Get Away with Murder on Hulu every single night. Forever.

[00:11:55] Dwyane: Nice. Yeah, for me, I don't know. I think they'd find they would. It would just be me working out while I binge watch. Like either Kath and Kim or whatever show I'm watching. So similar.

[00:12:07] Koji: Yeah.

[00:12:08] Dwyane: I don't talk.

[00:12:08] Cat: Or maybe me like talking to my dog, just being like, hey baby. Oh, I love you.

[00:12:14] Dwyane: But I do sometimes pump myself up like I don't talk to myself, but I do sometimes pump myself up. You know, like I'll just positive self-talk. Just like I might do something.

[00:12:24] Koji: Yeah, they would. 

[00:12:24] Dwyane: Slightly okay. And be like, yes, Dwayne they can't fuck with you.

[00:12:28] Koji: At my house. There would be like, why are they still talking about baseball?

[00:12:30] Dwyane: Yeah.

[00:12:31] Koji: They're still talking about baseball. Oh my God, don't they talk about anything else other than baseball?

[00:12:36] Cat: They'd be at my place. I'd be like, I love you. Do you know I love you? You know I love you. And then they'd be like, it's a dog, cat. It's she. He doesn't. He doesn't know that.

[00:12:45] Dwyane: Baseball was a secret code word. Like it's got to be something else.

[00:12:50] Koji: He's a Chinese spy. All right. There was even some evidence pointing toward a cover up. Tosha's recordings and other evidence were later compiled as part of ABC's 2020 documentary program, mainly with the focus on these political figures being surprisingly easy to blackmail rather than fixing, or rather than fixating on the affairs. However, ABC executives intervened for unclear reasons. I know exactly the reasons, and hours before the program was set to air, it was canceled. One of the executives involved in the decision was Roone. Or was it Rooney? Roone? I don't know. Roone Arledge, who was friends with Robert Kennedy's widow. He claimed that this relationship did not affect his decision. I'm sure it didn't.

[00:13:31] Dwyane: So let's look at means, motive and opportunity. They could have been means, but no murder weapon was found, and Monroe's death was ruled to be an overdose of her prescribed medication. As for motive, well, there's a couple of possibilities. Mostly centered around protecting the Kennedys and or state secrets. The opportunity is the difficult thing. The only time Robert or John could have reasonably killed Monroe was when Robert Kennedy was at her house. Unless they hired a hitman or had her killed some other way. However, that's more likely than either man directly killing her. They don't do their laundry. They're not gonna murder.

[00:14:12] Koji: By the way, isn't it funny that there was a political time when having an affair would, uh, probably be bad for your career? And now? Yeah. Now you could, like, you could rape little children. And I'm not naming names, but you could be on a list of people who raped.

[00:14:26] Cat: Best friends with people who rape children.

[00:14:29] Koji: Jeffrey, you mean.

[00:14:31] Dwyane: But that even changed from last year because last year was like, let's get the list and let's. And now it's like, well I mean they were 16. They weren't eight. You know what.

[00:14:43] Cat: Are they're like, oh.

[00:14:44] Koji: That's okay.

[00:14:44] Cat: Just put stuff into the list so we don't even know what's really in it. That's uh uh, remember that time it was like Hillary's emails, and then they saw every mention of pizza and decided that that meant kiddie porn.

[00:14:57] Koji: Well, even worse, that basically they were right. Except for the pizza part. Except that it wasn't the Democrats.

[00:15:03] Cat: Except for that. It wasn't Hillary.

[00:15:04] Koji: It wasn't Hillary

[00:15:06] Dwyane: Right maybe it's not a party thing. It's just a guy thing.

[00:15:09] Koji: That's what's so funny. I mean, I was talking to this guy recently who was saying, uh, what if it was Obama? And I was like, then he should go to jail. If he's fucking raping children, I don't care who it is, but.

[00:15:18] Dwyane: I think we we would know if it was him.

[00:15:20] Koji: Yeah, but but but the point is like, I don't care who is doing it. Anybody who's doing it, whether I like him or not, should go to jail. Like it's not that hard.

[00:15:29] Dwyane: That person is like trying to set you up because they're basically projecting, saying, it's my guy, so I don't want to do anything about it.

[00:15:36] Koji: Which is crazy because I don't care who. I mean, really, like, if it's my best friend, if he's if he's doing something with little children, I want them to be in jail.

[00:15:43] Cat: I kind of think they did put some crazy stuff in there, because some of the stuff is, like, so wild that you're like, oh, they they put this in so that we would talk about it and they could dismiss the entire thing.

[00:15:52] Koji: Like the testing.

[00:15:53] Dwyane: They need AI to read the whole thing because.

[00:15:56] Cat: Cream cheese. Yeah.

[00:15:57] Dwyane: Yeah. Or even the thing about the one that came out a few weeks ago, maybe a month ago, about Trump.

[00:16:03] Koji: Testing.

[00:16:04] Dwyane: Blowing Clinton.

[00:16:06] Cat: Oh, yeah, he blew Bubba. That was funny.

[00:16:08] Dwyane: That was really weird.

[00:16:09] Cat: This is true. Crazy stuff, you guys. But let's look at the evidence. We're not just seeing if they killed her. We're looking at any connection between her death and the Kennedy family. Were they responsible for her death? Or was it one of the many misfortunes in her life that contributed to her suicide? When we come back, we'll figure out what really may be happened. Now that we've reviewed the evidence, let's give our theories.

[00:16:35] Koji: Here's my theory. Monroe was actually a time traveler from our current day who.

[00:16:43] Dwyane: Like now.

[00:16:44] Koji: Right now, who didn't want to see junior go into the administration.

[00:16:49] Dwyane: Okay.

[00:16:50] Koji: So he was trying to have an affair with the father to kill him so that Kennedy junior would never happen because she was worried about the measles outbreak and the fact that she's going to ruin everything, just like the whole administration.

[00:17:04] Dwyane: Who's going to ruin everything? Jfk, RFK.

[00:17:07] Koji: Rfk, junior.

[00:17:07] Dwyane: Rfk, Jr. Oh, okay. Okay.

[00:17:09] Koji: So if the junior if the RFK is dead, then junior doesn't come and then everything changes. And maybe Trump doesn't become president.

[00:17:17] Dwyane: So does she want RFK dead or just not to be president? Does it mean maybe he lives?

[00:17:21] Koji: He wanted to be dead so that he wouldn't have a child.

[00:17:24] Dwyane: She was going to kill him.

[00:17:25] Koji: Yes, that was the goal. She's a time traveler from from the current day.

[00:17:28] Cat: Hmm.

[00:17:29] Dwyane: And then it didn't work out.

[00:17:30] Koji: It didn't? Yeah, it didn't work out. She got killed. But it was a whole struggle.

[00:17:34] Cat: My theory is that they poisoned her because they're like, oh, she died of the.

[00:17:40] Dwyane: Who's they.

[00:17:40] Cat: From? The Kennedys.

[00:17:42] Dwyane: Okay, okay.

[00:17:43] Koji: Like literally them or they hired somebody.

[00:17:45] Cat: I think it was RFK. I think he administered the poison. He was there. I'm pretty sure he's like the last person to see her alive.

[00:17:50] Dwyane: Time release.

[00:17:51] Cat: Yeah. Like a time release.

[00:17:53] Dwyane: Poison.

[00:17:53] Cat: Yeah. Where he, like, somehow puts, like, he has her take some of her medication earlier, like, put something in her drink because it doesn't even have to be different. It could be her prescribed medication. He opens the capsule, puts it in her cocktail when she's not looking. Like maybe two of them. And then later, she takes her real dose. Boom. Dies after the real dose, but she doesn't even know that she's overdosed at this point because she had no idea she already took a giant amount of it.

[00:18:20] Koji: Why did why would they do it? Why are they killing her?

[00:18:23] Cat: She knows too much. And I think that she was really hiding. Was a threesome between both of the Kennedy brothers, RFK and JFK, and her. I think they had a three way, and I think it was mostly the brothers on each other.

[00:18:44] Koji: That went a whole different direction.

[00:18:47] Cat: And that's why she had to die, because, like, look, affairs are one thing, but being gay, that they would kill gay.

[00:18:55] Koji: It's not just gay, it's incest gay.

[00:18:58] Dwyane: Yeah. It's not. Yeah. That's not great.

[00:19:01] Cat: Yeah. I think they would kill over gay incest.

[00:19:04] Dwyane: That's interesting. I mean, I like both of your theories. The interesting thing about yours, Koji, is they did say when she was singing, they had to, like, cut. And then, you know, obviously she had to do it over again because she had she mistakenly said the internet is a girl's best friend. And they were like, what the hell is that?

[00:19:20] Koji: Yeah. See

[00:19:21] Dwyane: So.

[00:19:21] Koji: I didn't even know that, but. Okay.

[00:19:23] Cat: What?

[00:19:24] Dwyane: No. Okay. I'm just.

[00:19:27] Cat: You just made a whole new theory.

[00:19:29] Dwyane: Time traveler thing.

[00:19:30] Koji: Yeah. She pulled out her cell phone, and then people were like, what is that? She's like, it's a phone. And she's like, what? It's not connected to anything.

[00:19:36] Dwyane: I really. I really like the time traveler thing, but I think, um, I don't know.

[00:19:40] Cat: I know my gay affair thing sounds really far fetched and like, more farfetched than Time Traveler.

[00:19:45] Dwyane: Seemingly both hooked up with her. But yeah.

[00:19:47] Cat: The thing like it is weird that she was hooking up with both of them and that, like, maybe they knew. Like, that is so weird that they knew about it. And like, both of them are like, who does that on purpose? Like, that's just a very strange thing to do unless they're doing it simultaneously. And then all of a sudden it's a little bit less strange because I get okay if I'm seeing a guy and I'm also seeing his brother, and I want that first guy to marry me, and he finds out I was seeing his brother, then like, no shit, he's not gonna marry me. Duh. So why would she be so delusional that RFK would marry her if she knows? Because he probably knows that she's also sleeping with.

[00:20:27] Dwyane: They think they can do things that don't make sense. You know, she's figure I'll just be Marilyn Monroe and he'll just.

[00:20:35] Cat: I'll just have two affairs. Like, she's just kind of narcissistic and delusional.

[00:20:38] Dwyane: She probably had dated guys who knew each other before. And and, like, one guy was like, I don't care, you know? So she probably.

[00:20:45] Koji: Actually the problem is she watched too much Pornhub and she got, like, in her head that this is.

[00:20:50] Dwyane: When she was in this time.

[00:20:51] Koji: Yeah.

[00:20:51] Dwyane: She was like, yeah.

[00:20:52] Koji: It's like, this.

[00:20:52] Cat: Is back in time.

[00:20:54] Koji: Incest says porn is normal.

[00:20:56] Dwyane: Right, right right, right.

[00:20:57] Koji: So she's like, wait, I see it on the internet all the time. And so she went she went back in time. She's like, oh. 

[00:21:03] Dwyane: Right. I have two theories, but I'm actually in this case I don't want to go with the, the silly one. I want to go with the more credible one, for lack of a better term, let's say the CIA, but it's not necessarily CIA. It might be one level above. It might be. It's basically the same people who killed her, killed MLK. Both Kennedys and Malcolm, because the 60s were like they realized was such a pivotal time. And they they were about to sort of like lay the foundation for taking over the world in an irreversible way. And these are the people who posed a threat to that. And she posed a threat just by knowing the Kennedys, because, like, if the affair comes out, then people start looking and digging, and by finding out the Kennedy stuff, they would have found out some other stuff. So basically they needed to neutralize or she knew too much and she was messing up the long term plans. I think the Kennedys didn't realize it, though. They may have wanted to do something and maybe like.

[00:22:04] Koji: Oh.

[00:22:04] Dwyane: Got it. But but I think they got beat to the punch, so I would say.

[00:22:07] Cat: Oh, interesting.

[00:22:08] Dwyane: Cia secret cabal. Something of that sort. They did it because she wasn't playing by the rules. Basically, anyone who didn't play by the rules got eliminated. And each of these people kind of, like, mistakenly thought they could kind of change or do what they wanted, and then they all got eliminated. They got better. They started learning. Watergate is when they got sloppy because they were getting too comfortable with doing whatever they were doing. You know, I'll say CIA, but I think maybe CIA at the behest of.

[00:22:37] Koji: A cabal.

[00:22:38] Dwyane: Military industrial complex these kind of people.

[00:22:41] Cat: I think CIA was on the right. Right. That's why they took out MLK. But Monroe would have harmed the left because RFK and JFK were like, were liberals.

[00:22:52] Dwyane: I know, but it would have just caused people to examine government and everything in a way that they didn't want. Sort of like reporters really looking into everything. That's my theory. 

[00:23:02] Cat: More closely. Yeah, because if it was your theory, I think the people who would have done it wouldn't necessarily be the CIA, but maybe like the Democratic National Committee or whatever.

[00:23:10] Koji: Yeah, but also the parties.

[00:23:11] Dwyane: The mob was also involved.

[00:23:13] Koji: The parties are so close back then. Um, because you have to remember, the Southern Democrats were basically the Republicans and then the and then the northern, northeastern, uh, Republicans are basically Democrats, right? And so.

[00:23:26] Cat: So it would be them, the northeast, the Kennedy's own party would have done it is what.

[00:23:29] Koji: I mean. Well, that like I think the point is that more that they were like the the stark differences between Democrats and the Republicans now like the parties are like a little bit further apart. Back then, they were actually not there was a lot more like I mean, like the Southern Democrats were literally just Republicans. I mean, the Republicans today, but they were called Democrats because of civil war. 

[00:23:48] Dwyane: After the civil rights act,

[00:23:49] Koji: Because the Civil War. Yeah, they were that's why they were Republicans. But I mean, Democrats, but they were literally just Republicans. So that's one of the reasons why, if you like, when you like I did Poli-sci when I was in college. And that's why it's like there was a lot more like Democrats and Republicans working together back then, because.

[00:24:04] Cat: It was all kind of the timing switch up.

[00:24:06] Koji: Well, there were basically like the Republicans in the North were basically Democrats. And so that's why they would work together. And the Democrats in the South were basically Republicans, and that's why they would work together. So it wasn't like that. They, like these people were like, let's work together. It was more of more like they actually shared beliefs.

[00:24:20] Cat: So the CIA would have done both.

[00:24:22] Dwyane: Yeah, right. You're saying because Lincoln Lincoln was a Republican. So that made the South go Democrat.

[00:24:27] Koji: Correct.

[00:24:28] Dwyane: But then after the civil rights movement, they switched and.

[00:24:31] Koji: They just they did what they did. But that's why I like the political the in the United States politics. That's when like.

[00:24:36] Dwyane: The party switched.

[00:24:37] Koji: The parties became like much further apart. And there was a lot less, a lot less like, uh, going over the aisle and working together because there's just like they're much bigger differences, even though it's not huge, but it's bigger differences? You know, so like to your point, it would be like the there's not that much difference in the government. Like if they wanted to kill a Republican or Democrat. Now it's like a little bit bigger because it's, it's but I think it's more.

[00:24:59] Dwyane: So that's why I say it's sort of a cabal, because it's.

[00:25:03] Cat: I mean.

[00:25:03] Dwyane: Eisenhower told us about the military industrial complex. He told us on the way out, they probably would have killed them if he tried to tell us sooner. You know, it was just sort of like a pivotal time Vietnam War, Korean War, World War Two. Then after World War two, that's when we ramped it up, right? Korean War, Vietnam War, US versus Soviet Union, cold War. It was it was like, how can we ramp up more and more war? So I don't know, somehow I think everyone who got killed in the 60s just threatened whatever their agenda was, you know.

[00:25:33] Koji: To your to your theory. You know, one of the things that Epstein list has done is it's, I think, shown that there is a cabal of rich, very rich and very powerful people who are doing really bad things. And I can't I don't do not believe that this is like a one time thing? I mean, one of the things that's been surprising is how close Epstein was with, like, the Israeli government and other governments. 

[00:25:55] Dwyane: That's why they they throw us, diddy to make us feel like we accomplished something. We got a bad guy off the board.

[00:26:02] Koji: Yeah.

[00:26:03] Cat: But it's like it's always they catch the black ones, but the white ones they let go and ignore.

[00:26:08] Dwyane: Yeah.

[00:26:08] Cat: Even, even though the white ones.

[00:26:09] Koji: You guys heard the MJ theory.

[00:26:10] Cat: Bigger scale.

[00:26:11] Dwyane: Right, right.

[00:26:11] Koji: The Michael Jordan stuff. Michael or Michael Jackson, Michael Jackson. 

[00:26:15] Dwyane: That he was going to expose it somehow.

[00:26:17] Koji: Well, that he was protecting the kids like Neverland was actually.

[00:26:20] Cat: I heard about that.

[00:26:21] Koji: The whole idea was that Neverland was like his way of protecting the kids so that they don't have to go. And then, like, you talk to, like, some of the kids, like, Macaulay Culkin and other kids were like, yeah, that's what we've been saying for like the last 20 years, that it was actually to protect us. And he didn't want us to go, like, I guess. 

[00:26:36] Dwyane: That's crazy.

[00:26:37] Cat: But there is the documentary. Like, he definitely was doing stuff.

[00:26:41] Koji: Maybe, I don't know.

[00:26:41] Dwyane: But can you imagine like if, like hypothetically, if that's true, like you are trying to save people and then you get accused of that very thing.

[00:26:51] Koji: They went after him. Yeah. Because even though, like, I mean, like, for example, like I'm not I don't know this for a fact. And this is all allegedly. But like that guy, some of the guys in those videos or some of the documentaries were shady or they had like things going on. But I don't know. I mean, I don't want to say anything because I don't know enough about it, but that's what they're saying.

[00:27:06] Cat: Well, it's time for us to pick the unofficial official story, one that will answer this question once and for all. So which theory do you want to go with today?

[00:27:16] Koji: I can't get my mind off the incest porn. I'm just kidding. No, no.

[00:27:20] Dwyane: That is crazy. But I like the time travel. I think mine is. Yours is somewhat.

[00:27:26] Koji: More real.

[00:27:26] Dwyane: To what happened, even though we don't know exactly, but. Well, because the incest one, I when I saw that spoiler alert when I saw that on White Lotus, it bothered me. So I'm gonna say.

[00:27:38] Koji: That was on White Lotus this.

[00:27:40] Cat: Season three.

[00:27:41] Dwyane: No, there's a part there's.

[00:27:42] Cat: A yeah brothers.

[00:27:43] Dwyane: It's awful that that whole season I didn't really love I thought they, they like milked two, two more. There's two extra episodes that they just sort of milked things since. So since the mere thought of that is troubling. Uh, I'm going to go with the, uh, time travel one.

[00:28:00] Cat: I took it too far. I'm actually gonna vote for Dwayne's because I think it's like, even though the time travel one is fun, I do think it was like, yeah, of course it was the government, you guys.

[00:28:15] Koji: Okay. I'm not I'm gonna not be the bigger person. I'm gonna vote for mine.

[00:28:19] Dwyane: Nice.

[00:28:20] Koji: Because it's time traveler. Obviously it's a time. And then, you know, we we've already said aliens. It's not aliens.

[00:28:25] Dwyane: And I was going to go with aliens, actually.

[00:28:26] Koji: And also we know that she said the internet. So like you mentioned. So.

[00:28:31] Dwyane: Right. Right. That's a fact.

[00:28:32] Koji: Yeah.

[00:28:33] Cat: Wait what was your what was going to be your alien theory?

[00:28:36] Dwyane: Well, because my alien theory was when they were pillow talking, her and RFK, he maybe mentioned either JFK, RFK, it probably would be JFK because he was president, but he mentioned like New Mexico and some stuff that was found, alien stuff that people weren't supposed to know. And so she had that knowledge and maybe she was going to leak it to some people. She's Marilyn Monroe, people might believe it. So aliens came and took her out before she could.

[00:29:05] Cat: Okay, okay. Other theory. What if she was an alien?

[00:29:10] Dwyane: Awww.

[00:29:11] Cat: And they took away her life support thing.

[00:29:14] Dwyane: I don't want to take yours away, Koji, but I could get behind that.

[00:29:18] Koji: She was a cute alien then.

[00:29:20] Dwyane: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. She took.

[00:29:21] Cat: Well, she was engineered to be the most attractive person to human eyes.

[00:29:24] Dwyane: But that would explain why the brothers didn't mind sharing. Because they were like.

[00:29:27] Cat: She's the most attractive to human eyes. She was programmed by genius alien time travelers.

[00:29:32] Dwyane: Right, right.

[00:29:32] Cat: Duh.

[00:29:33] Dwyane: I don't hate that. I don't hate that. But we. I think we've.

[00:29:35] Koji: Already chosen time travel.

[00:29:37] Cat: Time travel. Mhm. Mhm. Okay. And that's the official story. We'll take another break and then we'll ask the question that you've always wanted to ask.

[00:29:47] Koji: All right. Marilyn is iconic for singing a very breathy sexy happy birthday to JFK. If you had to seduce a world leader to get some state secrets, what songs are you singing to them and how uncomfortable do you make it?

[00:29:59] Dwyane: Okay. You ready? Yeah, I'm gonna sing. Islands. Islands in the stream is that song by, um, um, Dolly Parton?

[00:30:06] Cat: Mhm.

[00:30:06] Dwyane: Because as soon as the word you say the word Island? They know what island you're talking about. And that's gonna make them uncomfortable and make them do what you need, whatever it is you're trying to get them to do. They're gonna either kill you or play ball because you say the word. You sing a song with the word island in it, like 20 times. Even though you're saying islands in the stream. That is what we are.

[00:30:31] Cat: Just, like, make really strong eye contact with them.

[00:30:33] Dwyane: Yeah.

[00:30:34] Cat: Like I get it island's.

[00:30:36] Dwyane: like. And at the end, you know, and we'll rely on each other. Aha. Epstein, you know what I mean? Just sort of. So that's the song I'm singing.

[00:30:48] Cat: Mhm. The seduction part is a tough one because otherwise I'd be like, okay, I'm gonna sing. I know a song that annoys people. I know a song that annoys people and this is how it goes. I was like, I know people.

[00:30:59] Dwyane: Has that ever worked in a seductive.

[00:31:02] Cat: No, no.

[00:31:03] Dwyane: Okay.

[00:31:03] Cat: That would be if I was to torture them.

[00:31:04] Koji: Oh, you would torture.

[00:31:05] Dwyane: Okay.

[00:31:06] Cat: I would torture them like that. But seduction. Gosh, that is tough. Definitely the one that goes, I'm too sexy for my shirt. Too sexy for my shirt.

[00:31:16] Dwyane: That's worse than your annoying song.

[00:31:20] Cat: Look, repulsion is a sexual feeling, too. In some places.

[00:31:24] Dwyane: that's true.

[00:31:25] Koji: What places?

[00:31:26] Cat: I don't know.

[00:31:26] Koji: I want to go there.

[00:31:27] Dwyane: People were probably like, S&M.

[00:31:29] Cat: Yeah, like weird kinks. It'd be like a masochism situation.

[00:31:32] Koji: Okay, I have a song. A song of seduction for my dog. It's called the Himmler song.

[00:31:38] Dwyane: The what?

[00:31:38] Koji: The Himmler. You know, like the Nazi SS leader.

[00:31:41] Dwyane: Okay. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

[00:31:41] Koji: Um, it's basically, I'm not gonna sing it, but it's about how I'm Mr. Himmler and my wife, and my dog is Mrs. Himmler. And we're chicken farmers because he was a chicken farmer. But we're so happy together that we don't become SS soldiers and leaders, and we don't kill 6 million Jews. So that's the song I would do.

[00:31:59] Dwyane: So is this a song you sing? Sometimes?

[00:32:01] Cat: Did you make this up?

[00:32:02] Koji: I did make this up. And I do sing it all the time.

[00:32:05] Dwyane: That's crazy. I almost got to hear it.

[00:32:07] Koji: But it's it's a happy. I mean, it's a it's a song where the himmlers are not mass killer. Or at least Mr. Himmler is not a mass.

[00:32:16] Cat: They changed their mind.

[00:32:16] Koji: Because they're happy as happy people.

[00:32:19] Dwyane: Is it because they have a dog or because the dog is Mrs. Himmler?

[00:32:23] Koji: Yeah. That one. It's weird. The more I talk about it, the less.

[00:32:27] Dwyane: Dog crotch thing is starting to really come into place.

[00:32:33] Koji: We all have songs, okay? this is the song I was singing to the world leader, and they would be like, what the fuck is going on? But then they would be so super turned on, I'd probably do the dance to the dog. I have a dance seduction. I do as well. So.

[00:32:45] Dwyane: Right, right, right.

[00:32:45] Koji: Yeah. That's where I move my hips and people are seduced.

[00:32:48] Cat: You know, there are some world leaders that you can seduce them just by playing a Kidz Bop album.

[00:32:57] Koji: Like a certain prince or former prince.

[00:32:59] Cat: I'm sure there's many.

[00:33:00] Dwyane: But if I was trying to turn on Hillary, I would say, don't mess with Bill. Oh, I mean, they're a team. But at the same time, I think there's chinks in that armor. You know what I mean?

[00:33:11] Koji: Why are you looking at me when you say chinks?

[00:33:13] Dwyane: I'm sorry, I just. That is the word, though. It just means like a, you know, a small. 

[00:33:21] Koji: Asian person. 

[00:33:22] Dwyane: In the armor.

[00:33:23] Koji: Oh. Okay.

[00:33:27] Cat: We truly appreciate your support and enthusiasm for our quirky, mysterious, and fun filled journey. Your curiosity and engagement make this podcast a joy to create. Stay tuned for more intriguing stories and remember to share, subscribe and leave a review. Until next time, keep wondering and stay unofficially official.

[00:33:46] Koji: Now that we're at the end of the season, we want to thank all of you for listening and being part of our team. We're going to take a month off, but stay tuned. We're going to have a best of season five and a season six trailer, which Jesus I need to do. I haven't done that, so I gotta do that. Sorry. Thank you guys.

[00:34:00] Cat: Thank you.

[00:34:01] Dwyane: Thank you Guys. Bye. 

[00:34:02] Koji: Bye.